PSA

Dear Atheist Community,

Calling religious people names, being condescending, and using derisive terms like "sky daddy" pisses them off. When they are pissed off, they really don't want to listen to your arguments, it just validates their stereotypes about non-Christians. Bravo.

I understand that that is how you may want to talk amongst yourselves, and that sometimes debating a fundie is like debating a brick wall, but, well, I don't find "sky daddy" that funny =/ It doesn't pass my humor test, and just serves to show how much you don't care about religious beliefs because you are, in fact, that edgy and awesome. It ranks as pointlessly situationally offensive.

Granted, the bloggers that use these terms within the community are doing it for the atheist audience, and I have seen some of them debate with respect, but so many people dogpile with "Idiot" in a debate, which is, again, pointlessly offensive.

Apparently, as a strong atheist, I'm supposed to believe that all religion should be eradicated, and we should all live godless lives in harmony. I'm supposed to be confronting belief in God, and not try to "pass" as anything but an atheist.

Well, I think that's a bunch of crap.

If you're going to argue, you need to be respectful in these cases. It's the same as when a fundie calls you names and is irrational: you know it's safe to ignore them. If you want respect as an atheist, it is only fair to give it in return. Besides, in matters of faith, it isn't so simple as a logical argument. In a lot of cases, you either have it or you don't, or you used to have it, but the way your life and education took you means you don't have it anymore. It's not a light switch. I really don't think it's a rational part of humanity.

This is why these arguments (religious v. non-religious) rarely go anywhere beyond mutual respect. It's not an argument to be won, it's an argument to be felt.

Religion truly becomes a problem when it is not compatible with modern life and has a heavy role in government and society (I wouldn't mind living in a true Buddhist nation, not that Buddhist countries are doing too well at the moment, but that's not Buddhism's fault). It very much has this place in America, which is why the nation of my birth is one of the worst industrialized, rich nations on the planet in terms of women's rights and social welfare.

When religion is relegated completely to the private, to the community, I don't really think it's that bad. People need different things to remain whole, and some people like religion. When they use that religion to interfere with society, to bully, to try and stop science and reproductive rights, that is when religion is a harmful force. But then, any ideology can do that. It's not a magical property of just religion.

But, the idea of the world being better if we were all atheists is one I'm not sold on. True, there would be little opposition to evolution and certain types of scientific research, but people who tout the idea that life would be better if it were wholly secular are operating under the false assumption that the world would embrace secular humanism in its godlessness.

This is a pretty unlikely scenario.

There are plenty of secular theories that are just as harmful as religion, or, at least, still engender some of the same social problems, like the subjugation of women (Confucius touted this, and last I checked Confucianism isn't a religion).

"Atheistic" China still has all the markings of Confucian thought, down to the fully internalized way of ordering family members: father, mother, older brother, younger brother, older sister, younger sister, self. Is secular China a home of freedom, happiness, and scientific advancement? Perhaps the answer is "yes" to science, but in other social areas, it is having a hard time. My Mandarin teachers always sarcastically state "men are always first in China." And they manage to be first without God. This is not a socially stable and happy nation.

You could say that it is because Chinese culture is holding on to antiquated notions, just like the religious, but Chinese culture isn't static. It has been changing for years, including years of "gender equality" during the Cultural Revolution. It didn't stick after Mao's death. The 70s and 80s saw a full scale revival of "proper" gender roles, with little resistance. There was a revival of traditional values. I personally think it's natural for people to gravitate back towards older ways of doing things, even if they aren't necessarily the best in their situation.

In the end, people weren't convinced by gender equality, so they went back to what they knew and believed in.

Human beings like to create in-groups and out-groups. As we globalize, this is becoming harder and harder to maintain. Some people now categorize by nation, by language, by profession, by region of birth, by interest, by religion, but we all do it to an extent. People who are like us and are awesome and people who aren't like us (and therefore suck).

The same people who do and believe harmful things as fundies would likely find some sort of bullshit secular theory to keep up their unequal societies. There are also religious groups, such as the Quakers, who strongly believe in the separation of Church and State, and who I think are a wonderful example of how religion can be had without it being harmful to society.

But, seriously, the belief that we would all be better off without religion is rather misguided as some secular ideologies can be harmful. What that statement really means is, "we'd all be better off if we all believed more or less what I do," which sounds a lot like fundies, doesn't it?

It's an oversimplification of the underlying issues of society, a naive solution put out by people that like to poke members of their out-group (the religious) with sticks for amusement. Militant atheists are just as bad as militant anything else.

DISCLAIMER: I still believe in protesting religion in schools and the government, and coming down hard on people who want to erase the line between Church and State, and on people who use religion as an excuse to be horrible to people or to deny them rights. Debate creationists until doomsday to keep them out of schools, please. Just don't attack or think less of people because of religious beliefs. That's being childish, and yet, I hear atheists telling people that's what they should be doing.